Change the movement : Pittsburgh Indymedia

Change the movement
by Ben O'Dell Tuesday, Mar. 25, 2003 at 7:06 PM
bdo2@pitt.edu

Plans for a new division of the anti-war movement

I think we have to look at how we can be more effective as a group. I for one, like most of you, don't approve of the idea of a pre-emptive war. I think if change is to take place in Iraq, it should come from within. I think it's hypocritical that we as a country are prepared to use things like DU bombs to rid the world of Iraq's "weapons of mass destruction".

However, I think we need to recognize that the American public doesn't care too much about war unless it starts costing American soldiers their lives.

I think it's important for us to hold onto our anti-war stance, in fact it's crucial to do so. But we also must look for more practical demands. The United States, save for the occasional circumstances beyond our control (and they do happen), isn't going to pull out of war.

That said, I think we need to mobilize to ensure that Iraq is rebuilt in an effective and fair manner. We cannot afford another Afghanistan.

Our demands could be as elaborate as we want to make them. Some ideas I've had (in a mere 10 minutes of brainstorming) include:

-Fully repairing Iraq's hospitals and bringing them up to date

-Aiding money to Iraq's schools to bring them up to the level of the United States

-Eccessive food aid (doubling or tripling past ammounts given to other similar situations)

-setting up a system where the money gained from Iraq's oil well goes to the direct benefit of their people

If anyone is interested in focusing in on the process of rebuilding Iraq in future protests, please contact me via email. Perhaps we could even form our own affinity group and idenitfication purpose ("Blue-Block" or something of the like)

Again, I don't mean to take away anything from the idea of an Anti-War or Peace movement (I fully believe in both and feel that this should go hand in hand with them). I think we have a responsibility though, to also strive for what will be best for the people of Iraq.

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Beyond anti-war
by Stinky Wednesday, Mar. 26, 2003 at 7:42 AM

This is not a bad idea. I think we should push for something like this, starting immediatly with the humanitarian aid the US has promised, which they have not made good on thus far. I was watching the Canadian news on C-Span the other night and they actually did a five minute piece on this very issue. American bombs have taken out water pumps and thousands of people are left without water and the Americans don't really seem to care. We need to continue to push for peace, but expand to make sure that the US makes good on its humanitarian promises. Although, what's more inhumane than war? See ya on Sunday at the picnic and the rally.

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fine, but...
by pjd Wednesday, Mar. 26, 2003 at 11:05 AM

You aren't suggesting that we should support all these measures in the context of a US colonial-military occupation, aren't you??

Do I support massive post-war monetary and food aid? Yes! But the aid must be unconditional, and it must be in conjunction with a total US military withdrawl from Iraq. Pigs will fly before this happens, nonetheless to demand anything else will be to accede to the US paternalistic, colonialist objectives.

The Iraqi people are perfectly capable of rebuilding their nation's infrastructure and industries, and establishing democratic government(s), including an independent Kurdistan. Once again, pigs will go to Mars before this happens, but to demand anything less is to compromise our consciences and ideals.

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fine, but (rewrite)
by pjd Wednesday, Mar. 26, 2003 at 11:10 AM

You aren't suggesting that we should support all these measures in the context of a US colonial-military occupation, aren't you??

Do I support massive post-war monetary and food aid? Yes! But the aid must be unconditional, and it must be in conjunction with a total US military withdrawl from Iraq. Pigs will fly before this happens, nonetheless to demand anything else will be to accede to the US paternalistic, colonialist objectives.

The Iraqi people are perfectly capable of rebuilding their nation's infrastructure and industries, and establishing democratic government(s), including an independent Kurdistan. Once again, pigs will go to Mars before the US let's this happen, but to demand anything less is to compromise our consciences and ideals.

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clarification
by Ben Wednesday, Mar. 26, 2003 at 4:01 PM
bdo2@pitt.edu

i'm not at all trying to advocate U.S. colonialism with Iraq, rather trying to make sure that we expand to cover the topic of aid to the Iraqi people while the issue is still relevent.

after the war, i'm sure there will be minimal focus from the media on how iraq is rebuilt. it's up to us to make sure the situation is addressed now.

again, it's unlikely many of these measures will be met. it's our duty thought to make sure these issues are placed in the public spotlight. as far as a tactic to gain support for our movement, i would imagine that the public would be very receptive to the idea of seeing that Iraq is rebuilt in a proper manner (though i have been proven wrong before).

it's a difficult stance to incorporate into the anti-war movement, because on a certain level it has to encourage U.S. military action, however indirect. still, i think it's worth taking a look at because it really does matter and we could influence it.

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I'm with pjd
by Sam Thursday, Mar. 27, 2003 at 2:52 PM

The demand must be: unconditional withdrawal of the U.S. military from Iraq.

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KDKA
by Shriver Friday, Mar. 28, 2003 at 3:17 PM

It is my humble opinion that it is good
to reach beyond KDKA's daytime warmonger
hosts to the ears of their audience
1 877 855 KDKA

Mike in evening and Bob through the night
are much better hosts

Perhaps KDKA sponsors could be called
and told that peace people boycott war
advertisers, and that Rush Limbaugh
must be removed from KDKA

http://www.organizepittsburgh.org
http://indymedia.org
http://www.poetsagainstthewar.org
http://www.humanshields.org
http://www.catholicworker.org
http://www.internationalanswer.org

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KDKA
by Shriver Friday, Mar. 28, 2003 at 3:18 PM

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maybe...
by Catherine Saturday, Mar. 29, 2003 at 12:59 AM

maybe people should start aiming for demands that can reasonably be met.

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"reasonable demands"
by david Sunday, Mar. 30, 2003 at 1:15 AM

And what are "reasonable demands"?

When women demanded the right to vote in the 1860s, was their's a reasonable demand?
When miners, railway workers and other laborers demanded the right to form trade unions at the turn of the century, was their's an unreasonable demand?
When African-americans demanded their civil rights in the 1950s, was their's a reasonable demand?
When people demanded the withdrawal of US troops from Vietnam in the 1960s, was theirs a reasonable demand?
When lesbians and gay men demanded their civil rights in the 1970s, was their's a reasonable demand?

All of the above are examples of morally reasonable demands which, when they were originally voiced, many disparaged as idealistic and unworkable. Instead of demanding their right to vote be included in the 15th Amendment (1869), should women have made a more "reasonable" request? Instead of demanding desegregation in Montgomery, Alabama (1955), should African-americans have made a more "reasonable" request?

If practicality trumps morality--as it did in Germany in the 1930s--then we may as well give up hope for a just world.

Operation Iraqi Freedom lacks moral justification; thousands will die as a direct result of the war, and millions will be harmed by the war's long-term social, economic and political consequences. We demand the withdrawal of US troops from Iraq precisely because it is a morally reasonable demand -- to ask for anything less is itself unreasonable.

www.andrew.cmu.edu/user/dmeieran/weblog/peaceblog.html

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